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 Post subject: Re: Glory days
PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2012 11:07 pm 
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Emily Dickinson wrote:
'84 - Your character should always include a full description of all of your Powers, with the numbers for Attack and Damage (and any other effects) already calculated for that level. If the Spreadsheet doesn't do it automatically, you can put each Power on an index card by hand or whatever, but you should not ask players (including yourself) to consult the book in order to use a Power.


I think the template my buddy gave me will fix this problem. Basically, you got a sheet of paper for your at-wills, your encounters, and your dailies. Six spots on each page for powers, and they look like they're blocked-out similarly to the book. It's pretty plug-and-play. If that wasn't enough, there's a fourth page as just a list of the names of all the different powers (and rituals) you currently have access to. It's pretty nifty.

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 Post subject: Re: Glory days
PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2012 11:24 pm 
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Randraugir wrote:
What about using the offhand weapon to parry ? No attack but a defensive option like a shield that adds to your AC and wielding a extra weapon like this can give you more options in weapon choice. But if you use the offhand weapon to strike you also loose the AC bonus. This is a very realistic option too.


I thought of something like this. Actually, I went about brainstorming rules for a buckler. It would also add a conditional +1 AC bonus, but only in certain situations that didn't involve the use of that hand for offensive physical attacks. The benefit here is for spell casters who like to dual-wield implements, or for two-handed weapon fighters who can't wear shields at all...

I'm also thinking of making this dual-wielding thing not an everyday feat at all. I'm thinking of even making it a weapon multiclass feat, sort of like the spiked chain and blowgun, etc. So if you want to dual-wield versatile weapons, you'd take the class-specific weapon multiclass feat, and then there'd be more feats you could take for different dual-wielding techniques. I think doing it this way could even give Rangers more options, and then it becomes a win-win for everyone, but not game-breakingly simple to obtain. One of those further feats could grant the defensive bonus, as you suggested.

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 Post subject: Re: Glory days
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2012 12:13 am 
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Well, there already are feats that give bonuses to characters (Rangers or not) that dual wield - Two-Weapon Defense, for example.

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 Post subject: Re: Glory days
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2012 5:23 am 
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Location: Australia
Could I suggest you play at least a few levels worth of the Rules-As-Written before you make too many changes? While you might not like them entirely as they are, the monsters etc are balanced against the players capabilities...two attacks per round seriously increases the damage output of players, and you might find the game less challenging for players against like-level monsters. If you then have to tweak the monsters to bring some balance and challenge back in, you'll then have to tweak something else, and the cycle will continue.

If you only have a few players (ie, 2-3 at most) and want to build characters based on concepts rather than classes, then you might find it easier to get rid of rigid classes all together. Pick a base class to give HPs, proficiencies, special class features/abilities etc and each time they level they can pick new powers and feats from whatever class they like. Don't change the relevant attack stats (ie, don't pick a Fighter attack power and make it INT based instead of STR based), but otherwise open them up to grow in whatever ways they want.

That might be more flexible and more balanced than modifying everything you don't like.


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 Post subject: Re: Glory days
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2012 12:03 pm 
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tinkin wrote:
Could I suggest you play at least a few levels worth of the Rules-As-Written before you make too many changes?


Fair enough

tinkin wrote:
While you might not like them entirely as they are, the monsters etc are balanced against the players capabilities...two attacks per round seriously increases the damage output of players, and you might find the game less challenging for players against like-level monsters. If you then have to tweak the monsters to bring some balance and challenge back in, you'll then have to tweak something else, and the cycle will continue.


Why would someone try to tweak the monsters? I'd leave them as they are and just throw the party at more of them, or instead bring them into higher levels of monsters. Both of those options are much more beneficial to the player's ego, in my opinion.

Besides, if it's more of a Class-specific multiclass thing, then it's no longer attached to the basic attack. Instead, your two-weapon attacks come from further feat powers purchased as your levels progress.

But it would probably be prudent to go through one whole campaign with the rules as they are before I go changing things. That is true. But good ideas are good ideas, even if they emerge in the second campaign of one's DMing experience. And good ideas are basically what Dragon Magazines are made of.

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 Post subject: Re: Glory days
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2012 12:05 pm 
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Emily Dickinson wrote:
Well, there already are feats that give bonuses to characters (Rangers or not) that dual wield - Two-Weapon Defense, for example.


True. Which is why I was more interested in the buckler. It's a new idea (to 4E) with a whole new piece of equipment to go along with it.

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 Post subject: Re: Glory days
PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:09 am 
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GoliathAssassin84 wrote:
Randraugir wrote:
What about using the offhand weapon to parry ? No attack but a defensive option like a shield that adds to your AC and wielding a extra weapon like this can give you more options in weapon choice. But if you use the offhand weapon to strike you also loose the AC bonus. This is a very realistic option too.


I thought of something like this. Actually, I went about brainstorming rules for a buckler. It would also add a conditional +1 AC bonus, but only in certain situations that didn't involve the use of that hand for offensive physical attacks. The benefit here is for spell casters who like to dual-wield implements, or for two-handed weapon fighters who can't wear shields at all...

I'm also thinking of making this dual-wielding thing not an everyday feat at all. I'm thinking of even making it a weapon multiclass feat, sort of like the spiked chain and blowgun, etc. So if you want to dual-wield versatile weapons, you'd take the class-specific weapon multiclass feat, and then there'd be more feats you could take for different dual-wielding techniques. I think doing it this way could even give Rangers more options, and then it becomes a win-win for everyone, but not game-breakingly simple to obtain. One of those further feats could grant the defensive bonus, as you suggested.



A extra weapon feat would work well with DEX as pre requeste.
In AD&D 2e you can use a buckler for just one melee attack made against you, so you add the AC bonus only to one attack of your choice.

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 Post subject: Re: Glory days
PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:12 am 
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I like that...

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 Post subject: Re: Glory days
PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:37 am 
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tinkin wrote:
Could I suggest you play at least a few levels worth of the Rules-As-Written before you make too many changes?


No, I'm a DM and rule tweaking/changing is my nature. Rules are more like guidelines anyway. I have been changing/adding rules for as long as I play games starting with goose board.

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Wishes are premonitions of things you are capable or realizing.


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 Post subject: Re: Glory days
PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 9:42 am 
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lol :D Check out my new joke thread. It matches my new signature 8-)

http://dnd4.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2012

Feel free to pirate it with any similar kind of foolery you can think of.

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